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Incident: Delta Airlines B772 at Tokyo on Feb 7th 2010, stowaway found dead
Reader Comments: Reference: Stowaway survived SIA Flight in Nose Gear Well By Rudolf A. on Tuesday, Feb 9th 2010 22:15Z 11-Oct-2007 Possibly due to he lack of security in the month of Ramandan a stowaway managed to get onto the tarmac of KLIA Airport.
Upon arrival at Singapore Changi Airport on Thursday night a Palestinian man dropped out of the wheel well of a Singapore Airlines Flight. The man, Osama RM Shublaq, is said to have been a stowaway aboard SIA Flight SQ-119 that flew in from Kuala Lumpur at around 10:56pm. He stunned ground crew who were waiting to serve the twin-engine Boeing 777-200 after he fell out, apparently dizzy from a lack of oxygen, from the area where the front landing gear is stowed. The SQ airliner had just taxiied to Gate F33 at Changi Airport's Terminal 2 after a 55-minute flight from Kuala Lumpur International Airport. Aviation industry sources said they were surprised the man survived his ordeal. The stowaway was taken away by Singapore police and was charged in a Singapore court. If convicted he could be jailed for up to six months, caned three times or more, or fined up to £2,000. i'll check again By bimbels on Tuesday, Feb 9th 2010 13:53Z I pulled up the routing in our computers the day this story came out and it showed LOS...now when I try the info isn't listed via the sources I have (which is normal after several days, using my crew system) - It's possible I had the days mixed up (not accounting for a calendar day crossed on when leaving LOS) I'm headed on a trip today but I'll see what I can find out and post it when I'm back at a computer. ;-)
Incidentally, It would be unusual for an aircraft to arrive in JFK and then sit for almost 24 hours waiting for the next flight...not very productive. ;-) Though it is possible, under certain circumstances - but it wouldn't be the norm. Also, I do the JFK NRT route and know that we use more than one ship # (because there's one we particularly dread..LOL,) so at any rate this airplane does not only do JFK-NRT. (though it might have on this set of days.) But again I'll see what I can find out when I get back from Istanbul. @WorldWideWelshman: Hypoxia Mortality Risk By Rudolf A. on Tuesday, Feb 9th 2010 13:34Z "The most recent survivor was a stowaway who hid on a flight from the Dominican Republic to Miami in 1974." dated 2007
The real challenge will be hypoxia. A typical western office guy, untrained, may fall ill above 3000m. With adaptive training, freaks can do mountain climbing in the 8800m range without oxygen equipment. And Tibet and Afghanistan people are born to live and work at 4000-6000m. Altitudes beyond 7000m are called "critical zone" in the climber community, sometimes "death zone". Travelling in the unpressurised wheel well does not require hard climbing work - have a rest and relax focused on saving oxygen. At 10.000m you need to endure with less than 30% oxygen, compared to sea level. So it would depend on the individual's physical condition. Some uninvited guests may survive hypoxia, but most stowaways will not recover and die... @ Bimbels: route LOS-ATL-JFK-NRT? By Simon Hradecky on Tuesday, Feb 9th 2010 10:07Z Hello, Bimbels,
I have big, big trouble with the routing you provided, I can not imagine that the airplane did indeed NRT-JFK-???-LOS-ATL-JFK-NRT. I know the airplane was in Tokyo on Feb 5th and departed Narita as flight DL-58. NRT: departure Feb 5th 15:05L as DL-58 confirmed by radar data JFK: arrival Feb 5th 13:56L/18:56Z ???: LOS: only departure possible to have the airplane back in JFK on Feb 6th would be DL-53 Feb 5th 22:35L/21:35Z ATL: DL-53 arrived Feb 6th 05:31L/10:31Z JFK: departure Feb 6th 12:53L/17:53Z as DL-59 NRT The problem I have and which I believe completely rules out the Lagos rotation is: only 2.5 hours between verified arrival of N867DA in JFK and necessary departure in Lagos. At the same time, the FAA data have no Delta B777 between ATL and JFK on Saturday Feb 6th. Based on the data I have at hand I have the impression, though no conclusive evidence, that N867DA just shuttled between JFK and NRT starting Jan 5th 2010. Before pressurisation? By WorldWideWelshman on Tuesday, Feb 9th 2010 09:50Z @Rudolf A. Interesting stats - I wonder how many of the surviving uninvited guests "travelled" before high speed and high altitude were the norm? 7000 in a DC3 wheelwell wouldn't be much fun, but if you hung on avoided being crushed at least hypoxia would be less likely to get you! Does the FAA info indicate any survivors from a more recent (pressurised) airplane?
@bimbels By Stevo on Tuesday, Feb 9th 2010 09:13Z Bimbels where are you seeing the Lagos stop? N867DA doesn't seem to have any tracking information available outside the jfk-nrt route and seems to confirm this plane services only this route.
Perhaps Simon could clarify for us? Worrying and true By WorldWideWelshman on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 21:19Z @ Bimbels
Looks like you may be right. I suspect there would be little option other than to stop operating there (I expect you and your colleagues wouldn't mourn that decision for long!). Nigeria has something of a record of talking a story of change, but not executing it. I doubt it's got much to do with politics, more likely bribery by the foolish who see a route to a better life. Trouble is, as we all know, there's the "better life" this guy probably wanted, and the Al Quaeda version..... I'm a bit surprised that there isn't a closer walkaround prior to departure, or perhaps a US citizen employed by DL to do a final walk before the headsets/tug are disconnected after pushback.... Without that, I think you're probably right to be a little bit concerned... :-( I agree By bimbels on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 21:13Z I agree WWWelshman...Al Quaeda isn't going to waste a martyr in a wheel well. I'm more concerned about the fact that a person with no credentials (is reporting he had no passport or ID on him) was able to gain access to the tarmac, and the aircraft in general. If he can put himself in the wheel well, he can put a bomb in the wheel well too. and IF (big IF) he did board in Lagos, security measures enacted there since the failed Christmas day bombing aren't cutting it.
We are now entering..... By WorldWideWelshman on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 20:54Z Al Quaeda is not going to waste a martyr on something with such a low chance of success as camping in a wheel well. Bimbels says the aircraft came from Lagos, but nobody should assuming that's where the extra passenger got on. She's 100% right - the truth will out, so wait and see....
But Al Quaeda using wheel well stowaways to attack US aircraft? That's definitely twilight zone material. Unfortunately, to do that they'd have to be a great deal more stupid than they actually are.... By (anonymous) on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 20:42Z Undetected from Yemen? You expect them to hop alive from one wheel well after a 2 hour flight, identify the next ride to the promised land (after a freshen up in the Al Quaeda airside transit lounge), wander over to that airplane and jump in the next wheel well? Really? "In some cases the stowaways...survived..."? Show me one case! "Warm clothes are one requirement, outdoor training in the high mountains (e.g. Tora Bora) may be another one...". You don't say....
Really, a healthy imagination is a great thing, but we're heading for the twilight zone here, methinks.... :-) And as for being prepared for suicide, I reckon that would be wise, because that's exactly what would occur 15 minutes of leaving Yemen.... Bimbels is right (as usual). Wait and see, and doubtless all will be revealed. But I can't see the average wannabee martyr choosing this route when he can sit on the inside :-) Stowaway Mortality Rate By Rudolf A. on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 19:13Z According to FAA files, there are approx. 75 instances since 1947 of people who tried to hide in wheel wells of passenger planes. Only 15 survived (maybe some survivers escaped undetected). The mortality rate for this is around 80 percent due to prolonged exposure to sub-zero temperatures (-50 degrees C).
"It's extremely dangerous and invariably leads to death. Most people die because they are crushed by the landing gear, or they freeze, or they fall out of the plane." Security Hole to be closed? By Passenger M. on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 18:27Z "inspections required before each ETOPS departure don't need the doors open"
...and now the "Al Quaeda ambassadors" are going to infiltrate the US this way - undetected on transit from Yemen, where camels can access the ramp? Undetected at ATL, undetected at JFK? In some cases the stowaways survived the flight in the wheel well - no problem for someone prepared for suicide. Warm clothes are one requirement, outdoor training in the high mountains (e.g. Tora Bora) may be another one... Like I said.. By bimbels on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 17:21Z This tail number came from Lagos. I work for Delta and looked it up. This airplane does NOT go solely between NRT and JFK. The first clue that is false is that the flight leaves JFK for NRT at 1240pm. the NRT - JFK flight arrives at 1359. Which would be impossible to do on one aircraft, I believe. ;-)
No one is pointing fingers because the details of how (and where) this man got into the gear bay are not clear. Period. Plane inspection By Mike on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 17:18Z The gear doors aren't opened after every flight. The transit inspections required before each ETOPS departure don't need the doors open, just some of the higher level checks.
Previous Stops??? By GH on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 16:52Z I agree with Kev! If this A/C had stops in different countries, the US authorities would be the first to point fingers and they haven't done it so far.
Why people here are trying to cover the obvious lack of proper security work I don't know. Someone even wrote that probably the guy performed a round trip! So, you're telling me that this plane doesn't get inspected between long flights like every plane?? Dude, the americans are still learning how to deal with terrorism... and until then, I guess we will deal with a lot of BS. Routing By bimbels on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 12:01Z The aircraft routing was Lagos-ATL-JFK-NRT. Chances are he "boarded" in Lagos.
Stowaway on DL059 By rbquinn on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 11:09Z How about waiting for the preliminary results of the investigation before making uneducated comments!
By (anonymous) on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 10:28Z Climb up the main gear into the wheel well no problem. There is plenty of space between the doors to sit with the gear up. The hard part would be accessing the ramp.
By Robert on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 07:30Z There are many Nigerians in Tokyo. Possibly he may have done a round trip before being discovered. Many of the Nigerians in Tokyo are a menace, many of them work as touts for the bars, brothels and massage places in the nightlife areas and they are intrusive and aggressive.
Previous stops By Kev on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 06:31Z Unless I am reading the tracker incorrectly this plane solely services New york Tokyo?
By Wilson on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 02:30Z As previously pointed out, this stowaway probably boarded in one of the previous stops of this AC and not in NY. If he is in another country it is easy to assume the Delta plane is going to the US, but when departing from the US it is not that easy to know which aircraft is going where.
Still, another point of inspection that needs to be adressed. hello.. By aemie on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 01:12Z knock knock... who's there? best security facility.. well trained personnel.. a shameful incident.. at times, as an asean words of wisdom goes.. an elephant across the continent you saw but an ant in front of your nose you just can't notice..
stowaway By rediculous on Monday, Feb 8th 2010 00:48Z Who would stow away from NY to Japan...doesnt make sense. The japs are as anal as the yanks about this! but he could have done it from any previous flights either as the walkaround would have found him
Stowaway By Peter on Sunday, Feb 7th 2010 20:56Z Is there really enough unoccupied space in a 777 wheelwell that someone could find a place to sit during gear retraction without falling out, and stay after gear retraction without getting squished by the gear?
similar incident in 2005, also JFK By Rudolf A. on Sunday, Feb 7th 2010 20:20Z "In June 2005, body parts fell onto a home near New York JFK airport as an aircraft extended gears for landing. The man had died soon after take-off from Dakar on a South African Airways flight originating in Johannesburg."
And another one in January 2007: "Delta Air Lines found a dead stowaway in the right main wheel well of a Boeing 767 at Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta international airport. Flight DL-035 had originated in Dakar." By Mark Richards on Sunday, Feb 7th 2010 19:40Z "Someone in the wheel well would not be seen during walk around let alone by security."
Is this due to the fact that the gear doors are closed? severe security problem - airport in question to be identified By Rudolf A. on Sunday, Feb 7th 2010 19:23Z "...one has to wonder - particularly in the light of the Christmas Day bombing attempt - about the kind of security lapses which would allow someone to climb into the landing gear bay of an aircraft. Once the airport in question is identified, serious security questions will be asked..."
It's high noon for JFK Homeland Security to open an investigation. By (anonymous) on Sunday, Feb 7th 2010 19:15Z Someone in the wheel well would not be seen during walk around let alone by security.
By (anonymous) on Sunday, Feb 7th 2010 19:06Z wow, just like in the schwartzneger flick Commando, except he died during the flight instead of killing all of his enemies
@ mark By smiling jack on Sunday, Feb 7th 2010 18:16Z hey mark, good thought. would be interesting to know the itiniary of previous flights.
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